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Noelle Odessa's avatar

Thank you for sharing your personal journey and perspectives so openly. I appreciate your willingness to evolve in your thinking and self-reflect on previous stances. You raise many fair critiques about the philosophical contradictions and lack of coherence sometimes present in gender ideology discourse. The inconsistencies you point out in defining what constitutes a "woman," the rejection of objectivity by certain theorists, the overuse of "anti-trans" as a silencing tactic, and the concerns around medical ethics for pediatric transition are all valid points that deserve rigorous examination. Too often philosophical nuance gets drowned out by ideological rigidity on all sides.

I don't have substantive disagreements with the specific issues you outline, but I wonder if Fellipe do Vale's work could provide an avenue towards developing a more robust and coherent ontology of gender that helps to resolve some of these problems. In his recent book "Gender as Love," do Vale attempts to carve a middle ground between biological essentialism and pure social constructivism. Some of the key theses he explores include: gender having an essence not reducible to biological determinism, the complexity of gender and realities of oppression obscuring our epistemic access to this essence, any theory of gender needing to cultivate justice, and gender being grounded in how we as embodied selves organize socially-encoded goods tied to our sexed bodies through disordered "loves."

do Vale seems to be making a sincere effort at an integrated, holistic understanding of gender as oriented towards its fullest eschatological manifestation. I'm still grappling with his ideas, but wanted to surface his work as potentially relevant to the philosophical underpinnings you find lacking in certain expressions of gender theory.

Again, I appreciate you voicing these critiques openly and calling for greater philosophical rigor. Maintaining a spirit of honest inquiry while showing empathy for the human experiences behind gender journeys is so important as we continue to wrestle with these complex issues as a society.

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Bill Phlorgian's avatar

The hyper-defensive responses of some trans people to ANY CHALLENGE WHATSOEVER reminds me of the defensive posture of those with borderline personality disorder. In this condition, the patient has an unstable sense of self. This is always uncomfortable and will seek to rectify that by either adopting the self identities of the people around them, or making up a flimsy narrative of some kind and sticking to it by fiat. The latter is better than nothing, but the narrative is flimsy and easily attacked by anyone with more than two brain cells to rub together. When the BPD person is challenged they will often lash out in the ways we are now accustomed to online. It seems like social media is the perfect place for BPD suffers to feel like they thrive. There are flimsy virtual identities abound! Choose one today! As usual, they will lash out with vigor and spit anyone who dares challenge whatever cult narrative they have adopted that makes them feel special. It should come as no surprise that there is a high correlation between various kinds of gender dysphoria and borderline personality disorder.

As for Judith Butler's fans, I wonder how many people with borderline personality disorder are attracted to her particular brand of postmodernism?

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Ray Alex Williams's avatar

I've heard people also connect BPD to the typical narcissistic rage that happens when AGP trans women get "misgendered," which puts a crack in their carefully constructed narrative self and triggers the rage that has been so vividly captured in viral moments like GameStop Ma'am. Maintaining the narrative self becomes the predominant psychological drive and anything that challenges that narrative causes a disintegration of self.

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Plocb's avatar

The more I am exposed to it, the more this debate feels religious. Lack of common postulates, personal narratives advanced as proof, a demand to take EVERYTHING personally, and a defensive attitude worthy of a theologian. (Not to mention, trying to parse non-binary identities and the VERY IMPORTANT differences between them gives me flashbacks to trying to parse Protestant theologies and where they Importantly Differed.) There is no neutral ground, and all too little respect for others' positions. And purity culture pushing demands higher; we don't just want tolerance, we want acceptance! Not just acceptance, but celebration!

Some defensiveness is understandable; there are a number of viciously dedicated people who ARE anti-trans, and they're not all Bible-thumping morons. I've heard numerous bad-faith arguments, "think of the children" handwaving, and outright bigotry. At some point, though, the "WE'RE UNDER ATTACK!" rhetoric has to slow down, if only because people wear out from the constant outrage.

Of course, all of this is echoed by the dank sewer that is the Internet. IRL LGBTQ+ hangouts are much more chill. Likewise, if it isn't in their face, most straight people honestly don't care about the contents of one's pants. I think things are turning towards a more accepting culture; one day, people will be able to express themselves as they wish regardless of their gender marker. (Which I think is the long-term answer; don't need to hop/blur/stretch categories if there's room in your own.)

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